Time for #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales! We're going to watch "Duke and the Great Pie War" (2005) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TchPVLT80Vk …—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
I HAVE seen this one (unlike the previous 2 i reviewed) #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
As I recall, I was super confused by this episode of VeggieTales when I was a good Christian teenager #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
I seem to recall it's based on the story of Ruth, it's a love story, & the message is "women should be really forward when pursuing men romantically" ??????? #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
We start w Bob & Larry on the counter. They got a letter from Cody, a girl who just got a new baby brother & she's kind of jealous #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Larry suddenly reveals he has 3 brothers he never mentioned. one is Bob the Cucumber. Bob is SHOCKED. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
All right we're going to see the story of Moses & Miriam now #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Laura Carrot is Miriam. They are slaves in Egypt. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Her mom says she has a lot of responsibilities as a big sister. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Everyone is careful not to mention that the baby is assigned male #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
2 French peas come in & tell everyone to get back to work. They're like "oh, another baby girl?" & the adults just kind of ... poker face #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Mom tells Miriam she can never let the Egyptian guards know the baby is a boy. Mom refuses to explain why. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Miriam is angry abt how the baby gets all the attention now #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Miriam tells Mom she worked so hard taking care of the baby. Mom says that's her responsibility as part of the family. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
one day on the street, Aaron pushes Miriam out of the way of the princess's caravan & saves her, he gets punished for it #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Finally the parents explain to Miraim that the Egyptians are scared of them & are "taking away all the baby boys" #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Look how cute tho #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales pic.twitter.com/v9bNC8gaSE—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Miriam puts baby in a basket in the water where the princess is swimming. The basket floats away accidentally & Miriam is all worried, but the princess finds him & decides to keep him #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Miriam comes & tells the princess (who has a valley girl accent) she can get someone to help take care of the baby. gets her parents. :) The end. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
And now it's time for the Blues with Larry #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Larry sings about how everything is going well & he got ice cream. The lemon interrupts & says he's singing the blues wrong #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
strudel rhymes with poodle #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales pic.twitter.com/mP1AobQV9H—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
suddenly a gourd w an accordion turns up & we sing polka #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
All right time for the story of the Great Pie War #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Larry plays Duke Duke. He's a duke named Duke #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
here's Princess Petunia #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales pic.twitter.com/d9uxbABkN0—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
she was named as princess of the prom, now she lives as a peasant w her mother-in-law ("it's complicated") #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Pa Grape is running some kind of knight boot camp #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Mr Lunt plays Otis the Elevator, the most famous knight #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Otis will be facing competitors in the jousting tournament. larry looks nervous. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Meanwhile, Petunia & her mother-in-law are poor, & ppl pass by making racist comments, calling her a rhubarbarian #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Bob & Larry (Duke) are walking down the street. Mother-in-law has Petunia strategically out where she and Duke can see each other #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Duke & Petunia have an awkward flustered romantic moment #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Duke says he'll give her whatever she wants. She says no no, nothing. He insists they can have extra apples from his orchard #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
ppl are judging Duke for being kind to Petunia bc she is a rhubarbarian (that's racist) #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
—Christian Janeway CCMA (@XianJaneway) 2018-04-11
Oh now mother-in-law is telling their backstory #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Her son married princess Petunia (before the Great Pie War) #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
I'm really glad they didn't try to "clean up" this part of the story and remove the part where Petunia (Ruth) had been previously married. From a purity-culture perspective, having her be previously married throws a giant wrench in the whole "this is God's perfect plan for your love story" myth. Really glad they didn't try to change the story to make it fit that myth.bother their husbands died in the war. mother-in-law had to come back to her own country. petunia insisted to come & take care of her, giving up here life as a princess #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
mother-in-law has half a golden duck & needs to get the other half so they won't be poor anymore #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
wow okay Duke & Petunia are so crushing on each other & so awkward abt it. mother-in-law is trying to get them together. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
mother-in-law puhses Petunia to ask Duke to joust in the tournament & get the other half of the duck #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Otis the Elevator has the other half of the duck #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Duke is talking abt the importantce of looking out for family. bc he is related to mother-in-law. & Otis also is, but doesn't care abt them. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
it's time for the jousting tournament. which seems to be something out of American Ninja Warrior #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales pic.twitter.com/eE2uTTMXgr—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Duke didn't do well on the obstacle course section #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Next is a riddle. From the Abbott of Costello #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Bob says it's okay to back out, bc Petunia is a rhubarbarian. somebody yells "go back to your own country" #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Duke says he is looking out for Petunia first. that's what love is. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Duke wins #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Duke promises Petunia that he will take care of her forever. & they are family now #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
next scene is their wedding. aww how sweet. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Back on the counter w Bob & Larry. Bob says those were great stories abt loving your family #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Larry brought in his 3 brothers #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales pic.twitter.com/hx5M4A5fnJ—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
the 3 of them sing the "what have we learned" song #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
so basically the moral of the story is to love/protect/help your family #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Larry: "Because true love always thinks of others first." #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
all right that's the end of VeggieTales "Duke and the Great Pie War." Let's discuss #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
So that was... not what i expected from a Christian children's movie #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
So first there was the story of Miriam & Moses. I think it's quite weird to turn that story into a nice little lesson abt helping out your family when you have a new baby sibling #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
like........ they were in slavery & baby boys were being murdered #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
feels REALLY WEIRD to act like it's the same situation as your typical modern American sibling rivalry #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
overall it was a good lesson but it was just NOT a lesson that fit with the Miriam/moses story #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Like Miriam is upset she's not getting all her parents' attention anymore, & she has responsibilities taking care of the baby- the family structure has changed & of course she has feelings abt it #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
it's normal for kids to have feelings abt that—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
& they have to take the time to get used to the new situation #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales
but it's WEIRD that their being in slavery didn't really have much of an effect on the basic plot. & how the princess finding moses is treated as a happy ending #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
like, the princess finding moses was a really good thing & solved the problem of moses being at risk of being killed, but ... they're still all slaves at that point #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
like, good lesson to teach, but COMPLETELY THE WRONG BIBLE STORY to use to teach it #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Also it seemed like in the veggietales version, the basket w moses floated away accidentally #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
In the bible story (or, at least in my headcanon) Miriam floats the basket near the princess on purpose. It's part of her GRAND PLAN. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
All right let's move on to the story of Duke and the Great Pie War #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
so my overall impression of this is that the VeggieTales version WAS true to the story of Ruth in terms of how marriage was seen in that ancient society... #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
...but they didn't really say anything to indicate that in their society, marriage works much differently than in our modern society #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
so that's why it was super confusing to me when i saw it 13 years ago #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
So let's talk abt how marriage worked in the story of Ruth & in "Duke & the Great Pie War." #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
In their culture, women didn't really have rights, so widows were basically stuck in poverty if they didn't have a man to provide for them #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
so legally, a male relative of the dead husband would be obligated to marry the widow & take care of her—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
(don't know if that's *exactly* how the legal aspect worked, but something along those lines) #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales
this is also why premarital sex & divorce were SO BAD in that culture- bc the woman would be left "damaged" & without a man #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
so financially, she would be screwed #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Fortunately, our modern society is not like that. Women have rights. We have jobs & money & don't need no man. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
so, thank goodness, being divorced/ being a widow/ not being a virgin DOESN'T mean that a woman is just helpless & destined to live in poverty #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
So in "Duke & the Great Pie War", yes you could say it's a love story, but mostly it's driven by Duke's responsibility to provide for a poor widow who's connected to his family #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
the mother-in-law is pushing them together not bc they are so cute & in love & would be great together, but because she really needs Duke's help, financially #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
& yes they were cute & awkward & clearly crushing on each other. But i think it would have been better if, in an ideal world, they could just let their relationship develop freely w/o being forced into it for financial reasons #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
like, they haven't even been on a date, & Petunia is saying "I NEED you to joust for me" & giving him the half-duck, her most valuable possession... #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
... & Duke is making grandiose statements abt how he'll do ANYTHING for Petunia #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
it's sad that they had to make such big commitments so fast, instead of letting the relationship develop naturally. but bc of the situation Petunia was in, it pretty much had to be that way, unfortunately #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
just like Ruth & Boaz #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
back then, marriages were mostly arranged & for economic reasons—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
bc society didn't treat women as full human beings #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales
they had a very different concept of marriage than we do now—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
which is why you should all laugh at anyone who claims there's such a thing as "the biblical definition of marriage" #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales
So yes, within that context, Duke, Petunia, & the mother-in-law did the right thing #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
but i think it's really weird that the movie didn't mention that their cultural ideas about marriage are different from ours #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
like, maybe they could have had a narrator explain "back in those days, ppl did not let women earn much money, so a widow really would need a male family member to help her" #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
just something, anything, to indicate their culture/society/situation is different from ours, & their love story shouldn't be taken as a model for us to follow #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
It's actually pretty astounding how watching this VeggieTales episode illuminates just how TOTALLY REPRESSED I was back then. Like, this is presented as a lesson about our responsibility to help our family. It wasn't "here is how to have a God-approved marriage." It wasn't anything like that at all! But I was so totally repressed, so boy-crazy, so full of romantic attraction with no acceptable outlet, that the only message I could hear from VeggieTales "Duke and the Great Pie War" was "here is how to have a God-approved marriage."13 years ago when i watched this, as a good Christian teenager who was *starved* for romance bc i was in purity culture, i DID see it as "this love story is a model for us to follow" #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
but watching it now, it seems like it wasn't primarily abt the love story. it was abt Duke's obligation to help members of his family who are in need #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Petunia was poor & needed help. The fact that she & Duke were romantically attracted to each other was nice, but its wasn't the main thing. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
(again, this is true to the story of ruth & boaz) #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
But when I was in purity culture, i wanted to be in a romantic relationship SO MUCH, but believed it would be wrong, & to even watch a movie w a romance & fantasize abt it would be wrong #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
so here comes VeggieTales, which is recognized as good & Christian & definitely not one of those "worldly" bad influences, & this episode contains a romantic story #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
this was the only romance i was allowed to admire #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
this was the only Christian-approved romantic story i had #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
so of course i took it as a model. try to figure out how i could do what Petunia did & successfully get a man #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
i remember being SO CONFUSED abt how it seemed like Petunia just kind of *picked* Duke & then threw herself at him #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
like how am i supposed to know which guy is the right one to pick & throw myself at? #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
But watching it now, it doesn't seem to be meant as "here is how to have a god-approved romance". No, nothing like that at all. #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
It's not VeggieTales' fault that i took it that way when i was a teenager. that's purity culture's fault #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
but still, veggietales should have included some kind of explanation about how their society sees marriage really differently from ours #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Like, the lesson they were teaching was "take care of your family." In the story, their society was structured such that taking care of one's family meant marrying a relative's widow #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
So it would have been nice if they pointed out "that's what 'take care of your family' meant in their culture, but in our culture it would look different" #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
anyway overall the lesson was good, but in the end they did say "always put others first" which is not something you should actually literally do #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
Very important to take care of your own needs first! #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
overall, generally a good message but bizarre stories they used to tell it #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
as a bible nerd, i really appreciate how the veggietales version was true to the story of Ruth, but it's WEIRD that they didn't point out that things don't work that way in the modern world #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
OH ALSO i forgot to mention: "Duke & the Great Pie War" is also abt helping immigrants #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
ppl in the story were really racist toward Petunia, & they judged Duke for helping her #PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
---------------------so that's a good lesson for our modern-day situation—Perfect Number (@pnumber628) 2018-04-11
help immigrants~
#PerfectNumberWatchesVeggieTales
To see all my VeggieTales reviews: Perfect Number Watches VeggieTales (Master Post)
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