Tell me why the world is weird: On demons and what really matters

Here's a post from Tripp Fuller: I Am Undefeated Against Demons. 1 and 0. (via) It's about this one time where someone came to Fuller's church seeking an exorcism, claiming to be possessed by a demon. I love the part where the church secretary says to Fuller, "Since you’re the only one here from the South and you used to be an evangelical, we figured, you could handle this."

Fuller doesn't believe in demons. But here's someone coming to him, in need of help. He needs to help him, and the way to do that is just go along with the "it's a demon" framework, even though it's not.

He started talking. And while he was talking, his face would do a thing, and the voice would change, and the demon would pop out to say hi like an uninvited co-host on a podcast. Then he was back. Then the demon was back. Then he was back.
As I listened, here is what I was actually hearing. This guy was a horrible boss. He was making piles of money off people he treated badly. He was a workaholic. He had an addiction problem. He was taking all of it out on his family.
Now, friend. If anything is going to count as demonic, that will do.

Really fascinating that Fuller is witnessing this odd behavior and still totally doesn't believe it's a demon. The *actual* problem is that this guy is mistreating the people around him.

Fuller tells this guy that the way to get rid of demons is to let the love of God in. Accept God's love for you, and stop hurting the people around you. And Fuller prays over this guy, while hitting water with a palm branch- not that he believes the palm branch is doing anything, but because this "demon-possessed" guy is looking for some kind of ritual to get rid of the demon.

I'm really interested in this post because it's a perspective on demons that I've totally never heard before. Basically, the idea is that when people talk about demons, there aren't *actually* demons, but if people want to use spiritual concepts like that to describe their experiences, fine, whatever- BUT the important thing is about how people treat each other, about relationships, about emotional health. And these spiritual concepts like "demons" are maybe acceptable to believe in, but only in service to what actually matters (love, community, emotional health, etc).

(Here's a question: so apparently Fuller doesn't believe this "demon" is really a demon- but he tells this guy to "let the love of God in"- does he believe "the love of God" is a real thing, or is that also just an imaginary concept that we can believe in if it's helpful for us, sort of a metaphorical way to think about accepting yourself and caring for the people around you?)

Let's contrast this with the mindset where these spiritual things- heaven, hell, God, the devil, angels, demons- are real, and they are more real than the physical world we can perceive. The gospel I was taught said that what really matters is whether you go to heaven or hell for all eternity. Our lives on earth are just the blink of an eye; it doesn't really matter what we do here. The only important thing we can do in our earthly lives is to correctly believe in Jesus and "get saved" so we go to heaven instead of hell.

And so, in this mindset where the spiritual world is more real than the physical world, ideas like morality, human connection, and emotional health are kind of... orthogonal to what really matters and what's really real. Yeah sure, God wants you to be a good person, love others, etc, but that's just some arbitrary rules that God made up- we just have to do them because God said to, not because they are central to the things that really matter.

And there's a tension... The more you believe in hell, the more you believe that your friends are in danger of going to hell, the more you will harass them, lie to them, coerce them- anything you can possibly do to push them toward "getting saved." Belief in the realness of the spiritual world is at odds with common-sense morality.

At the church where I grew up, people didn't talk about demons lurking in the world around us, possibly affecting our lives. (With one exception: I heard warnings about Harry Potter. Specifically, the concern that Christians had was that the spells in Harry Potter are real, so if kids read the books and then try those things out, it really will summon demons.) I know there some churches where people talk about demons all the time, but that wasn't my experience. Then when I was in college, some of my Christian friends would describe things that happened to them as "spiritual warfare"- like "I had a really good conversation with a non-Christian friend, I told her about Jesus- but then after that, I felt really discouraged and just kept thinking about all the things I should have said differently- maybe it's spiritual warfare." Ie, maybe the devil is planting these thoughts of discouragement in your head, because you did a *good* thing by talking to your friend about Jesus, and the devil is trying to stop you. I kind of believed that, but also I felt like, "really? We really believe that the devil himself is influencing our emotions? Isn't that kind of, uh, crazy?" I always thought it was suspicious that people would call it "spiritual warfare" like a vague and abstract euphemism, comes across as less bonkers than "the devil is doing this to me."

I have 1 anecdote about demons. So, when I was a college student, I went to a Christian conference. At one point, there was a group of us just hanging out and talking, maybe 5 students, and one of the other students there (let's call her Claire) told this story about when she personally had cast out a demon. So this is something I heard secondhand; I have no way to tell you how true any of it is. But anyway, Claire said there was a girl, let's call her Hannah, who was acting weird one night, and putting her legs in weird positions, and Claire and her friends were sure it was because Hannah was possessed by a demon. (I think there was more to it than that, like Hannah had a history of weird/"sinful" behavior, so she was thought to be more likely to be demon-possessed than the average person, but I don't remember the details.) So Claire and her friends stayed there with Hannah all night, commanding the demon to leave "in the name of Jesus." Claire told us, if you say "in the name of Jesus," the demon has to leave, it has to. Apparently they sat there with Hannah for quite a long time telling the demon to come out "in the name of Jesus," and eventually, by the time it was morning, Hannah seemed to be back to normal.

When I heard this story, the main angle I viewed it from was "if this is true, this is PROOF that the spiritual world is real, and our Christian beliefs are true." That's what I wanted back then: proof. To get the enticement of atheism out of my head. Sure, there are plenty of people out there claiming some kind of miracle happened to them, but how do we know they're not making it up? Is there photo/video evidence? Do we have statements written down, by the people who witnessed it, immediately after it happened? Can we ask these witnesses a bunch of questions to get a clear picture of what happened, and make sure they're not mistaken about it?

So I viewed it through the lens of wanting proof, wanting to know if my beliefs were true or false. I noticed that my friends didn't seem to view this kind of story in that way- I had this urge to collect and preserve evidence, but other Christians didn't seem to have that. I guess they weren't viewing it in terms of "I need to prove this to myself and to other people." I guess they don't have something inside them that's always telling them to be an atheist.

It's very interesting to me, reading Fuller's blog post, about how he sees this guy right in front of him, exhibiting such odd behavior, and it doesn't affect his non-belief in demons at all. He just ignores all that, and says the real problem is the way this "demon-possessed" guy has broken his relationships with his family and co-workers, and the solution is to get this guy to accept the love of God, and then to treat people better. Like the question of whether the spiritual world exists- whether demons are real- doesn't matter at all. The only thing that matters is how we treat each other.

It's a perspective that views religion not as the realest thing, but as a tool that is useful only to the extent that it helps with the things we feel are most important to our lives in this physical world. Human connection, community, emotional health, that kind of thing. It's the opposite of "our earthly lives are just the blink of an eye, and all that matters is eternity in heaven or hell."

It feels like it's basically the same thing as "none of these religious claims are true at all, but they are good because they are useful for encouraging people to live in a moral way and love each other." (One could also make the argument that religion encourages people to do bad things, though. So maybe if all this is not true anyway, we'd be better off with no religion at all.)

So it's not "we believe our religion is true, now let's live according to the implications of that, no matter how strange they may seem- that's what faith is supposed to be." It's more like, we have our own experiences, real experiences and feelings in the physical world, and we're very rooted in that- that's real. And if religion can kind of give us a framework for viewing those experiences, great- but if religion ever tells us something too weird or not matching what we see in the real world, well then religion has reached the end of its usefulness, and we don't take it that seriously. Have common sense instead of having faith.

On the one hand, I like this, because it's something that actually makes sense (we should treat each other right) rather than something that depends on arguing about if demons exist/ if God exists/ etc. On the other hand, isn't this the same thing as saying my religion is not true? I don't like that; I want it to be true. I'm not just here for metaphors and inspiration; I really believe He lived and died and His tomb is empty.

But I'm stuck in a weird place where I feel that religion only matters if it leads you to do counter-intuitive things, things that look like a bad idea to people outside the religion; but also, don't ever do that- history is full of the wreckage of things that people did because their religion told them to, which everyone outside the religion could quite obviously see were bad ideas.

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Faith, Fruit, and "Do you actually believe your religion?"

"The Kingdom of Children" (a book about child liberation theology)

Being Right vs Doing Good

So. Demons.

Katy Perry's God-Given Freedom